# Floating Neutral Westinghouse iGen4500df Overload



## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

Hi al,

I just recently purchased the Igen4500DF to power our RV which has an Energy Management System (EMS). The iGen has a floating neutral which the EMS detects and prevents the generator from sending power to the rv. My research lead me to acquiring a bonding plug to resolve the issue. I have a honda generator which I tested the bonding plug with and it worked as advertised. When I insert the bonding plug into the iGen and fire it up it immediately goes into overload and doesn't sent any power to the rv. Is there a different method to get the bonding plug to work on this generator? I've seen others use these plugs on youtube with the same generator and it works for them. Could mine be defective? Any thoughts on how to get this to work?


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## OrlyP (Oct 19, 2021)

With the RV unplugged, does the overload light up with just the bonding plug connected?


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

Yes, it lights up when the bonding plug connected and nothing else.


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## iowagold (Jan 22, 2020)

i would use an inline rv amp volt meter to show your load...
try switching out the breakers on the rv first and then connect...
see if it likes the camper inlet...

then switch in the breakers one at a time.
to find what the gen does not like..

i suspect it may be the house battery charger...
99% of the time it is the issue....
or a water heater or fridge over load if they are 120 vac electric as a bi or tri fuel.


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## OrlyP (Oct 19, 2021)

It might be possible that there's a mis-wire somewhere in the iGen or the bonding plug. It could be that the bonding plug is bonding Hot and Ground instead of Neutral and Ground and seeing it as a dead short. It's sort of farfetched but it may be worth looking into.

I have looked at the iGen's manual and schematic and I can confirm that it has a floating Neutral. You might want to call up their support just to confirm whether or not the iGen is compatible with a bonding plug.

If you have a mutlimeter, check the bonding plug for continuity between Neutral and Ground. However, Hot to Ground and Hot to Neutral should obviously be open circuit.


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

OrlyP said:


> It might be possible that there's a mis-wire somewhere in the iGen or the bonding plug. It could be that the bonding plug is bonding Hot and Ground instead of Neutral and Ground and seeing it as a dead short. It's sort of farfetched but it may be worth looking into.
> 
> I have looked at the iGen's manual and schematic and I can confirm that it has a floating Neutral. You might want to call up their support just to confirm whether or not the iGen is compatible with a bonding plug.
> 
> If you have a mutlimeter, check the bonding plug for continuity between Neutral and Ground. However, Hot to Ground and Hot to Neutral should obviously be open circuit.


 I’ve acquired a second bonding plug and got the same result with it as well, iGen goes straight into overload as soon as I turn it on with the plug inserted. Both bonding plugs continuity tested fine with the multimeter. I now suspect a mis-wire somewhere also but not sure how to check for a mis-wire.


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## OrlyP (Oct 19, 2021)

Sandre2001 said:


> I’ve acquired a second bonding plug and got the same result with it as well, iGen goes straight into overload as soon as I turn it on with the plug inserted. Both bonding plugs continuity tested fine with the multimeter. I now suspect a mis-wire somewhere also but not sure how to check for a mis-wire.


Yeah, inverters have a mind of their own. Typically, the white wire is Neutral while the red wire is Hot. The iGen schematic does show both white and red wires coming out of the inverter module but it doesn't provide any other details beyond that.

Disclaimer: I don't know how deep your knowledge is but I am assuming that you know well enough to do voltage measurements with your multimeter. If you don't know how to measure 120V AC, STOP!

If you're ok to proceed, do the following:

1. With everything unplugged, start the generator until you see the green LED.
2. Set your multimeter for AC Voltage measurement with a range of 250V or higher (if it's not auto-ranging)
3. Measure the voltage and note them down:

Between Hot and Neutral =
Between Hot and Ground =
Between Neutral and Ground =
Note: When you look at the receptacles on the generator with the ground pin at the bottom, Neutral is the one on the left and Hot is on the right.


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## Columbotrek (11 mo ago)

Reviewing the i4500 schematic, I can confirm that neutral and ground are not bonded. But tracing the ground circuit I did see that it goes back to the inverter block. Not an expert in inverters shown as a brick but I would assume that brick is handling in logic what a alternator gen set is doing with wires and sees your neutral bonding plug as an issue so cuts off the power. So then why does the EMS unit care? That is different powering it from an inverter than shore power? The EMS would be looking for ground and neutral to be bonded at the shore power service panel. Your gen cable does have the ground connected so it can carry through from the EMS to the inverter? I think I would check a couple of things. I would do a continuity check of your cable. Then I would connect one end to the generator and using an AC volt meter check that there is no voltage between ground and neutral while the generator is out putting voltage. I would be confused if there was any as I expect would be the EMS as well. One thing the Gen does not have that the shore power would is an Earth ground. Have you tried tying the ground lug of the Gen to earth ground? Pound in a grounding rod if you can not find a metal water pipe or other suitable to strap to. Don't know but it could make a difference. Call Westinghouse tech support?


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

OrlyP said:


> Yeah, inverters have a mind of their own. Typically, the white wire is Neutral while the red wire is Hot. The iGen schematic does show both white and red wires coming out of the inverter module but it doesn't provide any other details beyond that.
> 
> Disclaimer: I don't know how deep your knowledge is but I am assuming that you know well enough to do voltage measurements with your multimeter. If you don't know how to measure 120V AC, STOP!
> 
> ...


Ok so I took the measurements as you stated and below are the results

Between Hot and Neutral = 125
Between Hot and Ground = 90
Between Neutral and Ground = 90


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## OrlyP (Oct 19, 2021)

Sandre2001 said:


> Ok so I took the measurements as you stated and below are the results
> 
> Between Hot and Neutral = 125
> Between Hot and Ground = 90
> Between Neutral and Ground = 90


90V across Neutral and Ground. That's probably why the inverter is shutting down. In typical shore power, there shouldn't be any high potential between N and Gnd. But with 90V across them, bonding those two is creating a short. Off-hand, I don't think that gen is compatible with bonded Neutral. I may be wrong but I think it's time to contact Westinghouse support and get them to weigh in.


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

OrlyP said:


> 90V across Neutral and Ground. That's probably why the inverter is shutting down. In typical shore power, there shouldn't be any high potential between N and Gnd. But with 90V across them, bonding those two is creating a short. Off-hand, I don't think that gen is compatible with bonded Neutral. I may be wrong but I think it's time to contact Westinghouse support and get them to weigh in.


Thanks for the input, I've contacted customer support, the person I spoke to stated that my issue wasn't in his script so he forwarded my contact info to the service department and someone is supposed to call me back.🤷‍♂️


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

Sandre2001 said:


> Thanks for the input, I've contacted customer support, the person I spoke to stated that my issue wasn't in his script so he forwarded my contact info to the service department and someone is supposed to call me back.🤷‍♂️



Per customer service recommendation, generator returned to seller.


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## OrlyP (Oct 19, 2021)

Sandre2001 said:


> Per customer service recommendation, generator returned to seller.


That was quick. I hope things pan out for you. Do keep us posted when you get a replacement.


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## Marlin (May 25, 2015)

By now, is there an update?


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## Sandre2001 (11 mo ago)

Marlin said:


> By now, is there an update?


Unfortunately I wasn't able to order another generator before we set out on our current trip. We should be back home by the weekend and I will look at ordering another generator. I will most likely do a little more research before ordering another one however, I will keep you posted.


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## Marlin (May 25, 2015)

Ok, great, thank you. I, for one, will be very interested in what you find.


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