# Re-jet my Honda EU2000i at 4700ft?



## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

I live at 4700ft elevation and my newish EU2000i runs great, easy to start, etc with about 10 hours on it so far. Except for the addition of an hour meter, it's bone stock out of the box. Would it be better over the long haul to use the 5000ft jet? I'd hate to foul things up because I know it has to be running rich with the sea level jet it came with. Basically, how "tolerant" are these jets with elevation changes? I've read posts of people using the stock jet at elevations far higher than mine with no problems. But, it seems like if there's different jets for different elevations, then they're there for a reason and might need to be changed as situations change. Thanks!


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> I live at 4700ft elevation and my newish EU2000i runs great, easy to start, etc with about 10 hours on it so far. Except for the addition of an hour meter, it's bone stock out of the box. Would it be better over the long haul to use the 5000ft jet? I'd hate to foul things up because I know it has to be running rich with the sea level jet it came with. Basically, how "tolerant" are these jets with elevation changes? I've read posts of people using the stock jet at elevations far higher than mine with no problems. But, it seems like if there's different jets for different elevations, then they're there for a reason and might need to be changed as situations change. Thanks!


Hello,

Welcome to the forum!
As a motorcycle and automotive mechanic for over 40 years, I can tell you that you won't go wrong changing that jet.

I do many re-jetting procedures so I know first hand the benefits of a properly jetted engine. I can summarize the benefits....
1). Better fuel economy
2). Better power
3). Cleaner engine (less carbon build-up, oil can stay clean longer)
4). Better running temperature range
5). Easier starting (in most cases)

So if you can, I would say go ahead and do it since you are right at the 5,000ft ASL altitude.

Modern automobiles have built in sensors and processes for adjusting the fuel ratio dynamically. Generators generally do not have this advantage because they are not expected to move around so much.

While you "can" run it as is, it will not run "optimally"

PS...adding the Hour Meter was a great idea!
Did you cut a hole and mount yours like shown on YouTube?
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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

Thanks for the quick response! I asked because of this graph I found. IMO, it's better run a little rich than a little lean.

http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/pe/pdf/pubs/pci54675.pdf


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> Thanks for the quick response! I asked because of this graph I found. IMO, it's better run a little rich than a little lean.
> 
> http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/pe/pdf/pubs/pci54675.pdf


That's true. Running Lean is much more destructive because that means running hotter. Your concern is understood.
But if Honda has a 5000ft jet, and you're right at 5,000ft ASL, you would benefit and I do not think your engine would suffer a chronic or even dangerous lean running condition. Maybe a hair slight of optimal. But not enough to ever fear damage from.

Notice on the chart that at your elevation, your Honda is down to about 84-85% of it's rated power. That will affect generated power output.

If you have concerns, check your spark plug by running it under load for a few minutes then shutting if off immediately with no idling.
The darker the plug electrode, the richer it is running generally speaking. A nice light tan color generally indicates a properly jetted engine. Whitish tan to white indicates too lean.

There is very little danger in your running lean at 5000ft ASL with the Honda 5000ft jet. Remember that pressure is not constant. Due to fluctuations in weather patterns, the atmospheric pressure at your 5000ft ASL location can vary. Honda knows this.
That said, I would NOT change the jet at only 3000-4000ft ASL.

If it were my situation, I would probably make my own jet with the exact orifice size needed and not compromise 

5000ft altitude change is significant to an engine. That said, keep in mind that "you can" run it as is. Just not "optimally"
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Regards
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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

I wonder if the Honda Power Equipment dealer would tell me what they recommend for this area without charging me. LOL


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> I wonder if the Honda Power Equipment dealer would tell me what they recommend for this area without charging me. LOL


lol
Probably.

I'm sure they've had that question a bizzilion times 

Just remember, they can't make any play by recommending no change.... haha.
I'm sure they'll be happy to install the jet for you.

If they recommend that you keep the stock jet, then they know that with the jet Honda recommends, it may be too small for your elevation.

I would go with whatever your local Honda Power Dealer recommends 
While I may have X number of years experience with engine building and repairs, very little of that is actually with Honda Generators per se 
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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

I meant just charging me for just an answer of what they recommend over the phone. That's basically what the local Honda auto dealer here does.


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## KRE (Nov 29, 2011)

buffettck said:


> I live at 4700ft elevation and my newish EU2000i runs great, easy to start, etc with about 10 hours on it so far. Except for the addition of an hour meter, it's bone stock out of the box. Would it be better over the long haul to use the 5000ft jet? I'd hate to foul things up because I know it has to be running rich with the sea level jet it came with. Basically, how "tolerant" are these jets with elevation changes? I've read posts of people using the stock jet at elevations far higher than mine with no problems. But, it seems like if there's different jets for different elevations, then they're there for a reason and might need to be changed as situations change. Thanks!


Old saying "If it ain't broke don't fix it."
Spark plugs are cheaper than pistons an cylinder walls. Fixed elevation numbers are one thing, density altitude is another. Engines run better/longer while producing more HP when tuned for Density Altitude. Ask anyone that has ever raced in the upper tiers where 2-3 HP is the difference between first or third place.


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

Predator said:


> Did you cut a hole and mount yours like shown on YouTube?


Sorry, missed this up above before. 

I only drilled a tiny hole for the wire that gets wrapped around the spark plug wire. I mounted the hour meter on the case with some very strong double-sided tape. Easy peasy.


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

I also called my local Honda dealer and talked to the service manager. He said to not worry about re-jetting it. Apparently, there's an easy +/- 1000ft overlap on that chart for the elevation levels and switching jets. He said they don't re-jet theirs and every one that comes in for service is running the stock jet and he hasn't seen any problems caused because of it. Nice!


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

KRE said:


> Old saying "If it ain't broke don't fix it."


Yup! :tango_face_grin:




> Spark plugs are cheaper than pistons an cylinder walls. Fixed elevation numbers are one thing, density altitude is another. Engines run better/longer while producing more HP when tuned for Density Altitude. Ask anyone that has ever raced in the upper tiers where 2-3 HP is the difference between first or third place.


Oh, believe me, as a former Navy helicopter pilot, I know alllll about DA. We live and die by it using the performance charts.


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## KRE (Nov 29, 2011)

buffettck said:


> Yup! :tango_face_grin:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Anyone that has pulled a Collective to beat the air into submission knows about DA :tango_face_grin:


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

KRE said:


> Anyone that has pulled a Collective to beat the air into submission knows about DA :tango_face_grin:


Gotta make sure you get those HIGE/HOGE torque numbers right!


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

KRE said:


> Anyone that has pulled a Collective to beat the air into submission knows about DA :tango_face_grin:


Haha!
Last time I did that was in a LifeFlight rescue chopper over downtown Atlanta.


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

Yeah, you don't "need" to change the jets....
You should get about 85-90% efficiency.
Or another way to look at it......about 7 hours of runtime out of each fill up on eco-mode....instead of 8....give or take.

But like I said....if it was MY generator at that altitude.....

I'd have to have the highest performing, best out-putting lil "racing" Honda generator in town so I'd make up a 61 MJ and get it juuuuuust right. lol


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> I meant just charging me for just an answer of what they recommend over the phone. That's basically what the local Honda auto dealer here does.


What?!?!

Charge you for an answer?

Why that's downright un-neighborly of them!


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## KRE (Nov 29, 2011)

Predator said:


> Haha!
> Last time I did that was in a LifeFlight rescue chopper over downtown Atlanta.


I only pulled on one west of S V/N in 1965 when the pilot allowed me up front for a few. Enjoyed it an he said I did well. So I was going to use the GI bill in civi life to take lessons, but the bill would not pay for fixed or rotary lessons. Instead you could reenlist go to Rucker here in bama an give them 6 more, I passed. I wanted to learn but not that bad. LOL 


Many places starting enhance their bottom lines with over the phone/internet charges for what should be free technical info. You bought/own their product, they should help you!


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

KRE said:


> I only pulled on one west of S V/N in 1965 when the pilot allowed me up front for a few. Enjoyed it an he said I did well. So I was going to use the GI bill in civi life to take lessons, but the bill would not pay for fixed or rotary lessons. Instead you could reenlist go to Rucker here in bama an give them 6 more, I passed. I wanted to learn but not that bad. LOL
> 
> 
> Many places starting enhance their bottom lines with over the phone/internet charges for what should be free technical info. You bought/own their product, they should help you!


Thank you for your service!
Glad you made it out.
You a SeaBee by any chance?


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## KRE (Nov 29, 2011)

Predator said:


> Thank you for your service!
> Glad you made it out.
> You a SeaBee by any chance?


Thank you. No not a SeaBee, just a guy who held his hand up when the call went out long ago.


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

Predator said:


> What?!?!
> 
> Charge you for an answer?
> 
> Why that's downright un-neighborly of them!


The Honda auto dealer here is always the de facto "answer" to bring it in so they can look it (and charge for it). Even with the simplest of questions. Thankfully, the Honda Power Equipment place I called wasn't like that and they were plenty helpful over the phone...for free! :tango_face_grin:


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

Predator said:


> Yeah, you don't "need" to change the jets....
> You should get about 85-90% efficiency.
> Or another way to look at it......about 7 hours of runtime out of each fill up on eco-mode....instead of 8....give or take.
> 
> ...


Well, the Honda guy I talked to here in my area at my elevation who works on these for a living said it wouldn't matter as he tried it on his personal 2000i. Remember, there's a thousand foot+ overlap on that graph at the 5000ft transition point. For me at 4700ft, if the stock jet is good to at least 6000ft, it would do no good switching to the 5000ft jet for a mere 300ft difference. Again, I'd rather have it a tad rich than the other way around anyway, if it actually is. :tango_face_smile:


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> Well, the Honda guy I talked to here in my area at my elevation who works on these for a living said it wouldn't matter as he tried it on his personal 2000i. Remember, there's a thousand foot+ overlap on that graph at the 5000ft transition point. For me at 4700ft, if the stock jet is good to at least 6000ft, it would do no good switching to the 5000ft jet for a mere 300ft difference. Again, I'd rather have it a tad rich than the other way around anyway, if it actually is. :tango_face_smile:


Good thinking buffet.
We are in agreement....for you, the stock jet is "good enough" (meaning will work) up to your altitude just fine.

And sure, the stock jet is "good" to 6,000ft. Heck, it will "run" at much higher altitude than that with stock jetting. No argument there.
But, at the end of the day.....you simply can't avoid physics..... after about 3,000ft with stock sea level jetting, it's not "optimal". Honda says about 85% efficient at 5000ft altitude. Would running a 61 or even 62 main jet cause your engine to run lean? With near certainty, I can say not to any degree that should concern you. Honda agrees since they recommend the 62 main jet at your altitude regardless. For all intents and purposes you are at 5000ft. 

I'm sure your local guy means well and probably is very experienced, but I do think Honda has more experience with your Honda generator than your "local guy" (or me). Honda has thousands of experienced techs and in house engineers. And Honda says change the jet at 5,000ft. For all intents and purposes you are at 5000ft. 

So what's the cost of using the stock jetting at 5000ft? It will burn slightly more fuel (running slightly rich instead of optimally), and your engine will experience slightly faster carbon deposit buildups than an optimally tuned engine, and your oil will dirty slightly faster due to more hydrocarbons in the combustion process.

Would I change the jet if I were YOU? Probably not. You would probably be uncomfortable changing the jet as you are convinced it's somehow dangerous to your generator. Peace of mind is what you'll have leaving it alone.

Is jetting worth it with a Honda EU2000i at 4,700ft? Some would say yes, others no. I would definitely change it. Honda says yes. That said.... your "local guy" says no and it's perfectly fine to be one of those who say "no" :tango_face_smile:

my 2 cents...but then I love talking about engines and tuning


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## buffettck (Sep 24, 2017)

Predator said:


> Honda agrees since they recommend the 62 main jet at your altitude regardless. For all intents and purposes you are at 5000ft.


Sorry, but no they don't. 5000ft is 5000ft. Anything less isn't 5000ft which is precisely where the Honda chart "recommends" switching to the 62 jet. I haven't seen an official Honda mention of a 61 jet. Besides, I'll be much more likely to use it at lower elevations than higher elevations, so I'll be sticking with the stock 60 jet. 



> Is jetting worth it with a Honda EU2000i at 4,700ft? Some would say yes, others no. I would definitely change it. Honda says yes.


Per the chart, no they didn't.


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## Predator (Sep 19, 2017)

buffettck said:


> Sorry, but no they don't. 5000ft is 5000ft. Anything less isn't 5000ft which is precisely where the Honda chart "recommends" switching to the 62 jet. I haven't seen an official Honda mention of a 61 jet. Besides, I'll be much more likely to use it at lower elevations than higher elevations, so I'll be sticking with the stock 60 jet.
> Per the chart, no they didn't.


Seems you are getting defensive over a difference of opinions.
You should stick with whatever you are comfortable with as I said.

Your Honda generator will work fine with the stock jet. I just outlined the realities of physics. 
You'll be running at about 85% efficiency per Honda. No biggie. (Do you disagree with that?)
It really is no big deal either way. If you were closer to 10,000ft then it would become significant.

I think 5000ft is a guideline. They don't mean 5000ft to the foot.
I assure you that for all "Intents and Purposes", (in terms of engine performance), that 4700ft is the same as 5000ft.
The change in density altitude over 300ft is negligible in most circumstances.
It would matter if you were flying an IFR precision approach in low visibility weather...but not for engine performance in a generator.

I would definitely rejet my generator at 4,700ft.....but then I'm probably one of those fanatical tuners 

You, sir, do not have to......trust me.....I'm not coming there with jets to make you change it lol

Have fun!


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