# Generator to house connection



## atxguy (Jun 25, 2021)

Alright, everyone...complete newbie here, so forgive me for what may be beginner questions. 

I am in Texas, and we had a pretty rough winter storm this year that knocked out power throughout the state (my home included) for several days. I am looking at alternatives to avoid similar situations in the future (I don't think ERCOT is going to be getting any better). 

I had an electrician install a whole house breaker in my GE box outside to shut off power from the city. He also installed an outlet where I can plug a portable generator into it. I have a natural gas line outside that I can use to power the generator. I am hoping to use natural gas as it is a continuous supply, as opposed to refueling with gasoline or propane. 

I have been looking at the Champion Tri Fuel generator, which offers 8750 starting watts and 7000 running watts with natural gas (10000/8000 with gas). The generator has a 30amp 120/240V AC locking plug. I am trying to determine if that is enough power to run my house (1400 sq ft, 2.5 Ton air conditioner). The other option that I am seeing for a portable generator is Firman 10000 watt tri fuel that runs 6900 starting amps and 5500 running amps on natural gas, but comes with a 50 amp plug. 

Would either of these work? How many watts should I expect to get from a 30amp 120/240V outlet? 

Thanks!


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## tabora (Sep 6, 2018)

30 Amps of 240V = 7200W continuous


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## drmerdp (Apr 10, 2018)

If you decide on the fireman, you can get a simple 14-50 to L14-30 adapter.


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## Browse Deweb (Jan 16, 2021)

Get a soft starter for you HVAC condensing unit. MicroAir makes an EasyStart model 364 that should work with your unit. This will reduce the inrush current (LRA) so that your generator won't fault out when it starts up.


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## motormonkey (Jul 10, 2016)

"I had an electrician install a whole house breaker in my GE box outside to shut off power from the city. He also installed an outlet where I can plug a portable generator into it."

I'm surprised that an electrician would do that. With that setup, it is possible to backfeed power from your generator to the utility line. You need an interlock or transfer switch to prevent that possibility.


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## iowagold (Jan 22, 2020)

motormonkey said:


> "I had an electrician install a whole house breaker in my GE box outside to shut off power from the city. He also installed an outlet where I can plug a portable generator into it."
> 
> I'm surprised that an electrician would do that. With that setup, it is possible to backfeed power from your generator to the utility line. You need an interlock or transfer switch to prevent that possibility.


snap some pix *atx guy.*
is there a way to interlock that ge box?
or is it one of the units that there are not any factory interlocks made for them?
I have a couple of places that make good interlock kits.

yea for some of the new electric systems that would be the place to interlock a system with sub panels at that disconnect bucket right after the utility meter.


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## drmerdp (Apr 10, 2018)

motormonkey said:


> "I had an electrician install a whole house breaker in my GE box outside to shut off power from the city. He also installed an outlet where I can plug a portable generator into it."
> 
> I'm surprised that an electrician would do that. With that setup, it is possible to backfeed power from your generator to the utility line. You need an interlock or transfer switch to prevent that possibility.


I assumed he had something like this installed. I’d be very disappointed if a licensed electrician failed to install a listed and safe generator feed. 








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## Browse Deweb (Jan 16, 2021)

Yep...it's probably a manual transfer panel with generator input.


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## iowagold (Jan 22, 2020)

MM was talking about a possible back feed when on utility possible...
that is what i saw...


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## motormonkey (Jul 10, 2016)

My response was based on what the OP wrote, and I read. "Whole house breaker" doesn't suggest any positive interlock or transfer switch. Perhaps the OP could clarify this.


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## Dfwhardhead (Jun 21, 2021)

Also a newb to this subject and really surprised to see the wealth of knowledge on this forum. Refreshing to see the vets helping us newbs out, unlike a lot of the social media groups. 

That being said, when backfeeding a main breaker is the purpose of the interlock basically to eliminate human error to insure that the main breaker(s) are not left on?


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## drmerdp (Apr 10, 2018)

Dfwhardhead said:


> Also a newb to this subject and really surprised to see the wealth of knowledge on this forum. Refreshing to see the vets helping us newbs out, unlike a lot of the social media groups.
> 
> That being said, when backfeeding a main breaker is the purpose of the interlock basically to eliminate human error to insure that the main breaker(s) are not left on?


Yes, exactly.


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## iowagold (Jan 22, 2020)

and back feeding is not the same as interlock.

back feeding is not a planned system
dangerous as well as illegal.

but an interlock system is a planned back up system.
and passes electrical and fire code.


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## JRHill (Nov 19, 2020)

Once the transfer switch/safety problem gets figured out here was my first reaction to the OP. But first let me qualify my position - we have lived off grid for 12+ years. We have most of what modern life entails, but not air conditioning (sigh, it was 117F here a few days ago). Just putting in a generator doesn't mean you can do all the things you normally do day to day while grid connected. You really should have a list of things that don't happen: the hair blow driers, the brewing coffee pot, the microwave maybe, the electric lawn mower, and other such high draw items. There are other ways to do these things and generator time is the time this is needed.

If you follow a previous suggestion for a soft start air conditioner this is highly recommended assuming you can't get by without it and assuming you can control/monitor other loads while the AC is running. There are many power hogs that you probably have and you should have a list. Go gather them up and put 'em in a box while on generator power.

And this is important: When all is ready shut your grid power off and fire the generator. Run on it for at least a day. Keep a written list of your experience, not just memory. So when the time comes you will know what is mandatory and what is optional. You might find you are eliminating things you never thought of 'cause they are niceties, not essentials. There is more to this but I hope to give you some basics.


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## iowagold (Jan 22, 2020)

we color code the breakers for clients.
and with live meters to watch the loads... you can see the exact power draw!
and yes a killawatt meter is a great investment.

we write down on each appliance the exact power demand.
that way you can plan your dinner power!
crock pot,
rice cooker.
coffee pot
microwave
instapot
instant point of use hot water heater
and more!
we have found the little rice cookers do not draw much!
and you can warm soup, cook oat meal and reheat other things as well!

pm if you need links on those items!


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## ajnuzzi (12 mo ago)

the 30 amp inlet will surely work for your generator on natural gas since that wattage decrease on NG. It's a shame he already did it because I would have strongly suggested you go with a 50amp inlet. This way if you ever want a bigger generator you're already set up for it. YOu can always run a smaller generator through a 50 amp but can't run a bigger generator through a 30 amp


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## kirklandlee239 (12 mo ago)

ajnuzzi said:


> the 30 amp inlet will surely work for your generator on natural gas since that wattage decrease on NG. It's a shame he already did it because I would have strongly suggested you go with a 50amp inlet. This way if you ever want a bigger generator you're already set up for it. YOu can always run a smaller generator through a 50 amp but can't run a bigger generator through a 30 amp


Glad i saw this. Im looking at he exact issue your speaking of. 30 vs 50 amp box. Problem im finding is: all the Gens ive looked at use the standard 4 prong twist lock plug. 2 hots, Neutral and a ground. Without installing an outdoor panel box and wiring a 30 amp and a 50amp box (separate breakers on both) ive found no way to utilize 1 box? Cant find 4 prong twist locks rated for 50 amps, and most 50 amp gens use the 4 prong Nema spade type connection. My reason was maybe in the future i could parallel 2 units to get the 50amp power if needed. I have seen 3 prong 50amp twist lock boxes, but really want everything to be plug and play, not having to deal with that 4th ground wire as a separate entity. Thoughts?


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## kirklandlee239 (12 mo ago)

kirklandlee239 said:


> Glad i saw this. Im looking at he exact issue your speaking of. 30 vs 50 amp box. Problem im finding is: all the Gens ive looked at use the standard 4 prong twist lock plug. 2 hots, Neutral and a ground. Without installing an outdoor panel box and wiring a 30 amp and a 50amp box (separate breakers on both) ive found no way to utilize 1 box? Cant find 4 prong twist locks rated for 50 amps, and most 50 amp gens use the 4 prong Nema spade type connection. My reason was maybe in the future i could parallel 2 units to get the 50amp power if needed. I have seen 3 prong 50amp twist lock boxes, but really want everything to be plug and play, not having to deal with that 4th ground wire as a separate entity. Thoughts?


Images show parallel kit connections 30amp.3 prong, and the 50amp Nema Spade. Now of course if your using 1 of the Dura 9000iH's, you need the 4 prong 30 amp cord. If you use the kit to parellel, you would need the 4 prong spade 50amp plug....How do you keep it safe plug and play user friendly without having to mount 2 separate boxes for whip connections? thanks.


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## drmerdp (Apr 10, 2018)

kirklandlee239 said:


> Glad i saw this. Im looking at he exact issue your speaking of. 30 vs 50 amp box. Problem im finding is: all the Gens ive looked at use the standard 4 prong twist lock plug. 2 hots, Neutral and a ground. Without installing an outdoor panel box and wiring a 30 amp and a 50amp box (separate breakers on both) ive found no way to utilize 1 box? Cant find 4 prong twist locks rated for 50 amps, and most 50 amp gens use the 4 prong Nema spade type connection. My reason was maybe in the future i could parallel 2 units to get the 50amp power if needed. I have seen 3 prong 50amp twist lock boxes, but really want everything to be plug and play, not having to deal with that 4th ground wire as a separate entity. Thoughts?


The 50amp twistlock connectors do contain a ground. It’s the metal plate on the side of the female connector.











kirklandlee239 said:


> Images show parallel kit connections 30amp.3 prong, and the 50amp Nema Spade. Now of course if your using 1 of the Dura 9000iH's, you need the 4 prong 30 amp cord. If you use the kit to parellel, you would need the 4 prong spade 50amp plug....How do you keep it safe plug and play user friendly without having to mount 2 separate 7boxes for whip connections? thanks.


Duromax and predators sister inverter generators have had inconsistency’s with their images and parallel ports. Parallel operation requires 3 ports. 2 hots and 1 neutral. The parallel cable/box’s grounds attach to a specific lug on the side of the unit. I went down this same road when I was considering a predator 9500 inverter generator to pair with an eu7000.
Available photos at least at the time only showed 2 ports for 240v operation only, but in person I found they it had 3 ports implying 120/240v operation.

Post #45








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